tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1658138279766595241.post1556569678669216621..comments2024-01-04T04:31:00.481-05:00Comments on Mixed Race America: When to say you're sorry and moving onward and forwardJenniferhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/13261371053113519712noreply@blogger.comBlogger7125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1658138279766595241.post-62473325874012825942009-08-06T09:16:32.622-04:002009-08-06T09:16:32.622-04:00Ralph,
I was being sarcastic, which is a form of ...Ralph,<br /><br />I was being sarcastic, which is a form of irony. I guess on the rest we'll just agree to disagree, but I do appreciate the apology about tone because it does tend to obscure having a real dialogue about important issues.<br /><br />Thanks, as always, for reading and commenting.Jenniferhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13261371053113519712noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1658138279766595241.post-90370445841350227662009-08-04T10:08:08.062-04:002009-08-04T10:08:08.062-04:00Hey Jennifer - I appreciate your response and your...Hey Jennifer - I appreciate your response and your commentary. Re wether you owe an apology - it's irrelevant, but I appreciate your owning your position. <br /><br />Re the condasention: It was very much intentional, though I realise in retrospect that the tone detracted from my point. (Which is very much what I'm going to write about below! :) I've got no problem acknowledging it was an inappropriate tact to take; and accordingly; am sorry for the condesention inherent. <br /><br />If you're frustrated with my inability to understand you, that I didn't come to the "correct interpretation" of your comment; do you extend the same to others? Do you accept the irony call if people make claims you feel are racially biased; when they say you didn't interpret them correctly; that you missed the "irony" of their comment? (I must admit that contextually, I'm struggling to see the frame for it myself your post, though I'm willing to accept it if you claim that was the intent) Do you think it's a legitimate response to someone you call out for racial, gender or other bias in their comments? <br /><br />"Irony" and "You didn't get it" are hardly the battle-calls of the righteous. <br /><br />Agh! I don't wish to be picking a fight with you on your blog; a fail al la grande for me. If your comment was "irony" than fair enough; it wasn't a disclaimer of responsibility. But please - use irony with caution. It's far too easily misinterpreted - such as in this case. I look forward to your future commentary on racial issues. <br /><br />best wishes; rchttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06428341662448130100noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1658138279766595241.post-4556705442591455202009-08-04T09:36:44.159-04:002009-08-04T09:36:44.159-04:00Ralph,
I don't think I was wrong to say that L...Ralph,<br />I don't think I was wrong to say that Lucia Whalen acting on racial biases and racist tendencies that she internalized. I think she has. And I'm not singling her out--I think we all, myself included, have racial biases and racist tendencies that we internalize. The sooner we acknowledge them the sooner we can work on them.<br /><br />So no, I don't think I need to apologize, and if you read through that post carefully and all the supporting links as well as the comment thread from Tami's re-posting on WHAT TAMI SAID you will understand why I even spoke about an "apology"--which is more an issue at Tami's blog than my own because to the best of my knowledge, no one here is asking me to apologize to Lucia Whalen.<br /><br />As to my rhetorical flourish of saying I'll apologize to her when Crowley apologizes to Gates, I owe an apology to you that you seem tone deaf to irony. <br /><br />And I am equally disappointed that you felt the need to chide me as if I were some "immature" schoolgirl. You may not have intended your comment to come across as condescending, but it did. However, I take your point--you didn't like what I wrote and you expressed that. We'll just have to agree to disagree on this point, although I wish you had made it in such a way that didn't rely on ad hominem language that was meant to potentially shame me. It didn't shame me, it made me a bit frustrated with your inability to understand the main point of my post and affronted that you were speaking to me with a patronizing "tone." Which I suspect may have something to do with a fair amount of unacknowledged privilege you hold? But I'm just speculating and could be totally off base, and if I am, I apologize, because I do not want you to think that I hold onto childish grudges.<br /><br />Thanks for reading and commenting!Jenniferhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13261371053113519712noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1658138279766595241.post-201382272195233072009-08-03T07:52:04.893-04:002009-08-03T07:52:04.893-04:00Genepool,
Thanks so much for this very long and ve...Genepool,<br />Thanks so much for this very long and very thoughtful post/response. I always appreciate your perspective--I esp. appreciate that you provide a good reality check for me about a world outside of my books and the university environment. And I can't agree more about the importance of a heartfelt apology when an apology is necessary. I esp. like the phrase that your co-worker coined: "Respect publicly, earn public respect" <br /><br />(of course the academic geek in me can't help but feeling gleeful because it is a chiasmus--don't sigh Genepool!)<br /><br />Julia, thanks so much for your appreciation, and Ralph, I have some thoughts about responding to your comment but I need to run out the door so it will have to wait.<br /><br />As always, I welcome your comments and dialogue and even disagreements.Jenniferhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13261371053113519712noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1658138279766595241.post-43908075315154812272009-08-02T23:41:26.648-04:002009-08-02T23:41:26.648-04:00You'll apologize when Crowley apologizes to Ga...You'll apologize when Crowley apologizes to Gates? That's not the attitude of a mature person taking responsibility for their own actions. It sounds like a child, trying to shirk that responsibility.<br /><br />You either think you were wrong and apologize, or you don't. That's it. Your actions should depend on no other person than yourself; least of all Crowley. <br /><br />I don't disagree with other things you say in your post and I'm not saying you should apologize - just the concept that you express in this sentence is saddening. It's a disappointment to hear something like this from someone whose writings I otherwise respect.chttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06428341662448130100noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1658138279766595241.post-20999535800104276432009-08-02T08:46:01.986-04:002009-08-02T08:46:01.986-04:00Thanks for this, Jennifer. Well said.Thanks for this, Jennifer. Well said.Juliahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09306553493879018542noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1658138279766595241.post-86898316571584564782009-08-01T03:59:27.743-04:002009-08-01T03:59:27.743-04:00I agree that the word "racist" has certa...I agree that the word "racist" has certainly taken on a life of it own. It gets thrown around so often for so many different reasons that it has lost a lot of impact for me. And its a word that SHOULD have impact. <br /><br />Now it seems a lot of times to be used in an accusing way, to hurt people for hurting sake. In my work it has taken the place of "ass hole" and rarely even gets the bat of an eye from me. Whatever dark feelings I may or may not be harboring about those of a different race/culture from my own, I know I am a pretty fair guy.<br /><br />Do I approach other races differently? Heck yeah, occasionally I do. Most of the folks I deal with speak English, but we don't all speak the same language. It took me years to learn to communicate effectively with inmates. Of ANY color. <br /><br />The best lesson one of my older partners ever taught was the amazing POWER of apology. I all cap the word power because I cannot stress enough what such a simple thing can accomplish in the environment I work in.<br /><br />I'll cliff's note the story... Basically, my partner took yard and day room privileges from an inmate for something that we later learned he hadn't done at all. This happens sometimes. Separating people quickly is often times more important than an investigation that can be done safely later on.<br /><br />Anyway, we figured out what had actually happened the next day and my partner, a 50 something Mexican-American fellow with an awesome sense of humor turned to me and said, "well, damn, I guess we gotta take a walk now". With just 18 months in at the time I had no clue what the hell he was talking about.<br /><br />We left the office we shared in our cell block, went out onto a full yard of inmates, went directly over to the large group of Southern Mexican inmates and called the fellow over. I was a little nervous. My partner matter-of-factly admitted he was wrong in front of the entire group and apologized at the same time.<br /><br />There are guys with a lot more years on the job than me who would laugh at the suggestion of apologizing to an inmate. They are not the people I care to work with.<br /><br />I have never forgotten both the appreciation and respect those guys had for my partner for not only coming to their homeboy out on the field where the advantage was theirs , but for apologizing in front of them as well. "Respect publicly, earn public respect". I'm not sure if he quoted anyone or made it up himself. Either way I thought it was clever enough to remember. <br /><br />I don't really know much about this story about Professor Gates and Ms. Whalen. Based on what I have read here I feel badly for them both really. He got hassled unnecessarily by police for doing nothing wrong. She is still getting hassled for doing what she though was right. We will never know if what she did was actually motivated by race or not. Does it really even matter at this point? She has her scarlet letter. If the professor had been white, this story would have never gotten any air time. Maybe a blonde joke would have circulated locally for a time (if she were blonde). And we can never know if she would have bothered to call the police on a white guy shaking a door, maybe in frustration. (I would if I were her from here on out)<br /><br />And Mr. Gates. Even if her motives were not racially biased, his belief that they probably were will still likely hurt him in some way. <br /><br />Yup. I feel bad for them both. <br /><br />And now we've both rambled. =)Genepoolhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13308610180196902757noreply@blogger.com